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laissez vibrer ties

Moderator: Michael Good

laissez vibrer ties

Postby Evan Brooks » Wed Jun 08, 2016 1:57 am

Hi Michael,

You recommend that laissez vibrer ties be represented with a Tied start and Tied stop on the same note. How then does one distinguish between a note that has a tie starting on it with no end note, and a note that has a tie ending on it with no start note?

It seems much clearer if the note just has a single Tied start or Tied stop to represent the two cases.

Finale exports the above situations differently depending on whether the Dolet Plug-in is used or not, and it also seems to export the start-only case differently than the stop-only case.

Export bugs aside, and using your recommended logic, how does one distinguish between the two cases of laissez vibrer ties?

--Evan
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Re: laissez vibrer ties

Postby Michael Good » Tue Jun 21, 2016 7:52 pm

Hi Evan,

Sorry for the delay in answering this, but I don't quite understand the question. What two cases of laissez vibrer ties? A pair of pictures might help me understand this better.

We have been making a lot of improvements to exporting these types of ties for the next version of Finale.
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Re: laissez vibrer ties

Postby Evan Brooks » Wed Jun 22, 2016 9:46 am

Hi Michael,

In an earlier post on this subject, you recommended that laissez vibrer ties be represented with a Tied start and Tied stop on the same note.

How does this recommendation allow one to distinguish between the following two "cases" of a laissez vibrer tie, which I would describe as "single-ended ties", or "unmatched ties":

Case 1: a note element that has a tie starting on it, but with no end note element for the tie

Case 2: a note element that has a tie ending on it, with no start note element for the tie

If each of those two cases is represented in MusicXML by a note that has both a Tied start and Tied stop on it, as I understand your recommendation to be, how can they be distinguished from one another when one tries to parse the MusicXML?

My instinctual solution would be to describe each case literally:

Case 1: the Note has a Tied start on it, and there is no matching Tied stop for it in the document.

Case 2: the Note has a Tied stop on it, and there is no matching Tied start for it in the document.

My solution allows the two cases to be distinguished readily. I don't see any way to do this if each case is represented by both a Tied start and Tied stop on the same Note element, as I understand you to be recommending.

The current version of Finale and the Dolet plug-in export these situations differently, depending on whether the Dolet plug-in is used or not, but in no case is anything consistent with the solutions that either you or I are suggesting. As a result, I am trying to start with a clarification of your own recommendation, and then hoping that future versions of the software will conform to it.

In the end, we have to be able to write software that can identify the above two cases of a laissez vibrer tie (or single-ended tie) in MusicXML. It's impossible to do so currently given the many different ways that the current notation software seems to represent them in MusicXML exports.

--Evan
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Re: laissez vibrer ties

Postby Michael Good » Fri Jun 24, 2016 11:00 am

Thanks for the clarification, Evan. L.v. ties are nearly always case 1. Case 2 is usually other situations like excerpts of music or a tie at the beginning of a 2nd ending. In MusicXML 3.0 the only way to distinguish these is through the x positioning on the start and stop elements.
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