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illogical <forward> element in samples

Moderator: Michael Good

illogical <forward> element in samples

Postby James Sutton » Mon Nov 16, 2015 10:26 am

There are various places in the sample XML files where the <forward> element seems to be used illogically.
For instance in BrahWiMeSample.xml line 1057
<measure number="3" width="217">
<forward>
<duration>32</duration>
<voice>1</voice>
<staff>1</staff>
</forward>
<backup>
<duration>32</duration>
</backup>
<note default-x="18">

A forward of 32 in voice 1, staff 1 is immediately followed by a backup of 32 (on all voices). To my thinking this places the following note (voice 3, staff 2) at 32 before the start of the measure! Why does it want to move the time to the end of the measure without doing anything anyway?
The same thing happens in measure 4.
In measure 12 there are 2 forwards at the start which could (should?) be coalesced.
There are similar problems in DebuMandSample, DichterLiebe01,MozartPianoSonata,and Telemann
James Sutton
 
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Re: illogical <forward> element in samples

Postby Mogens Lundholm » Tue Nov 17, 2015 3:34 pm

I think that 32 forward and 32 backwards brings you back to start. And that this has been
added manually to stress the system (i.e. my program and your program) for test - not because it makes any sense.

Kind regards
Mogens

PS: I have had my "fun" with exactly the files you mention
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Re: illogical <forward> element in samples

Postby Michael Good » Tue Nov 17, 2015 7:03 pm

Hi James,

You'll see that in cross-staff piano music. It shows that there is no music in the voice associated with the top staff of the piano part in that measure, but that there is no visible rest either. As Mogens mentioned, the 32 forward followed by the 32 back brings you to the start of the measure, as it should, for the start of the music in the voice associated with the bottom staff.

The two consecutive forward elements at the start of measure 12 in the piano part reflect an invisible half rest followed by an invisible quarter rest. Within Finale that's a more natural way to express the invisible notes than coalescing into the equivalent of one invisible dotted half rest. From a MusicXML perspective either one is correct.

Does that clarify things?
Michael Good
VP of MusicXML Technologies
MakeMusic, Inc.
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Re: illogical <forward> element in samples

Postby James Sutton » Wed Nov 18, 2015 3:35 am

I see. It is a little confusing but I see the motivation now.
Thanks
James
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